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Tech Gearing question

bloaker

Sincerely A Dick
Nov 14, 2011
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I lean toward Shimano, mostly because I'm very familiar with it and it works well for me. OTOH, SRAM offers more options for gravel/adventure gearing. Would like to try SRAM sometime before committing to buying a groupset.

If you can find derailleurs you want, I can loan you a set of shifters and brakes. - 10sp.
I only have one drop bar bike left and it is Campy, so nothing I can offer for you to test out.

My personal opinion - I really like the comfort of Compy. A few years back, their hoods were definitely the most comfy to me.
I do love how smooth my old Ultegra was. It was silent, just shifted when you wanted it to and I have no complaints - except the hood design.
I also had a SRAM on 2 bikes. One was my fargo and the other was a road bike. The Sram takes a touch more effort and you can feel it when it is done shifting. I don't want to call it a "Clunk" into place, but I am not sure what other word to use.

All in all - I was running all three brands simultaneously. I also never had an issue with any of them. Everything was 100% subjective regarding which I liked best.

Campy - Most comfy (11 sp)
Shimano - smoothest (10 sp)
SRAM - most configuration options (10 sp)
 

kiwisimon

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The Sram takes a touch more effort and you can feel it when it is done shifting. I don't want to call it a "Clunk" into place, but I am not sure what other word to use.
I call it tactile feedback. When I ride my sons Shimano Ultegra bike it's so light in shifting I think something is broken. I prefer the "clunk".
the new Red Etap is very comfortable, reminds me of early Campy Ergopower.
 

OreoCookie

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Dec 2, 2017
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Hood design is one thing, and the knubbly pseudo-105 hydraulic STI levers are atrocious, especially if you want to be in an aero hoods position. And Shimano’s shift/brake lever are really badly designed (the brake lever doubles as a shift lever, the throw of the upshift lever is huge and touching the downshift lever while trying to upshift will cancel the upshift).

I have tried SRAM Force 1 (with mechanical rim brakes and hydraulic disc brakes) on two occasion and it took me 0.5 seconds to get used to it and to convince me that I vastly prefer this to Shimano. As @bloaker and @kiwisimon said, the action is very positive — you know when you have shifted. IMHO it feels great, because you have clear, tactile feedback that you are lacking with Shimano’s mechanical shifters. On the other hand, that leads to a more staccato feel when shifting up and down rather than the smoother, more silent Shimano way of doing things. The “horns” are also great when going in the aero hoods position.

Some people claim SRAM is less reliable than Shimano. I can’t say, I have only had Shimano shifters, and on my last two bikes, I had Shimano shifters break on me (my road bike will go into service next weekend). But I think I just got unlucky, stuff breaks especially when you use it heavily. 🤷‍♂️

Moreover, SRAM just gives you more options when you want to go 1x.
 

Karl

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Feb 7, 2011
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I use a Sugino OX601D sub-compact crankset with 42/26T - ...There are many different chain ring sizes available for the Sugino, so combinations like 40/24 or 44/28 will also work, depending on your cassette and you desired gear range.

Been going over all the different options you and others have mentioned and am now leaning toward getting the Sugino OX901d. Since I know I can use a 40t rear cassette with my current 105 5800 rd, I'd like to get either a 28-44 or 26-40 double so I'll have a low gear below 20 gear inches. I've been looking at their website and can only find a small chainring (bcd74) of 30 for the OX series. Did you go with another manufacturer to get the 26t ring, or did you get that through Sugino?
 

microcord

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Aug 28, 2012
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A steel-framed road bike of mine has: 11-32 (?) 10-sprocket Tiagra (?) cassette, Tiagra RD, Dixna 43/27 crank, 105 FD, Tiagra brifters. (Yes I am old and feeble but I like to go up hills.) "Wish I had one less chainwheel" isn't a thought that has ever occurred to me, but each to their taste. The unused brifter could be repurposed as a seatpost dropper, perhaps?
 

joewein

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Oct 25, 2011
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I've been looking at their website and can only find a small chainring (bcd74) of 30 for the OX series. Did you go with another manufacturer to get the 26t ring, or did you get that through Sugino?

I don't know if the OX901D uses the exact same rings as the OX601d.

The reason I went for the OX601D instead of the "nicer" OX801D or OX901D was that I could get it with smaller rings. The chain rings sets offered with the 901D at the time were all for sizes 30T and up or 34T and up (can't remember which), not low enough for me. I bought the OX601D crank in the US (Soma) as a set with the inner and outer, but since they didn't have the 26T in stock at the time (only 24T or 28T) I bought that separately here in Japan. Later Soma sent me the 26T when they got it in again. Now I have that as a spare.

The inner ring is a 74J, which has been used on MTBs for a long time. It's basically an 8-speed ring. As an inner it's a straightforward non-ramped/pinned design, pretty basic. Sugino lists 74J rings from 24T to 32T on their website. You can find it here.

FWIW, my outer is a PE110S-42T, which is ramped and pinned for use with STI.
 

Karl

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Feb 7, 2011
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Thanks, Joe. Gonna ask the folks at Sugino about the smaller ring compatibility before I order. Hoping the smaller rings work on the 901. Doesn't seem like there are many places still offering the 601 anymore.
 

Karl

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Feb 7, 2011
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A steel-framed road bike of mine has: 11-32 (?) 10-sprocket Tiagra (?) cassette, Tiagra RD, Dixna 43/27 crank, 105 FD, Tiagra brifters. (Yes I am old and feeble but I like to go up hills.) "Wish I had one less chainwheel" isn't a thought that has ever occurred to me, but each to their taste. The unused brifter could be repurposed as a seatpost dropper, perhaps?

Was at Y's Road today and thinking that the Dixna 43/27 might be an option for me. They quoted me a price for the Sugino ox901d with 30/44 rings at 46,000 yen w/o BB. I can order the Dixna 43/27 on Amazon for 24,000 yen. Soooo... How have you gotten along with the Dixna? Like it?
 

microcord

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Aug 28, 2012
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How have you gotten along with the Dixna? Like it?

Swimmingly and yes, respectively.

I do occasionally wish my top gear (43-11) were higher. It's not high enough for me to keep up with my chums on long descents. But since I'm not racing (and since crashes tend to be likelier and nastier at 55 km/h than at 45 km/h), I don't mind much. And if I did mind, I should practise spinning.

I had the bike put together at a bike shop (HiRoad). I brought in the frame (which I'd got from Yahoo Auction); I bought all the parts (and labour) at the shop. This was for various reasons. Of course my own ignorance and laziness were high on the list. But I was also keen to avoid minor but fatal incompatibilities of the kind that I might not notice even if I'd been bothered to bone up on technical specifications.

There weren't any incompatibilities (as far as I know). A friend who's a lot more knowledgable and a lot less lazy than I am was impressed by some aspects of the setup and got a Dixna crankset (46/30?) for a bike he was building up. It turned out that there was an incompatibility, so he had to buy a different (and more expensive) model Dixna crankset (with the same numbers of teeth). That worked well and he's happy with it.
 

Karl

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Feb 7, 2011
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I'm looking at the Shimano FC-M785 38-26 crankset for my bike.

It is a 10 spd crankset but I intend to use it on my 11 spd, which should be OK, I think. It would be about 13,000 yen cheaper than the Sugino ox901d I've been looking at and has the chainring sizes that would work well for me. Still hoping to keep my drivetrain all-in-the-Shimano-family and this one fits the bill. Would there be any reason it wouldn't work with my Shimano 105 build and road bike bb?
 
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Karl

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Feb 7, 2011
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After all of my hemming and hawing, I finally decided to get a Shimano SLX 36-26 crankset. I installed it and tried to use my 105 FD but had a problem. I understand that two of the BB spacers are supposed to be put on the drive side and one on the non-drive side. When I did that, my FD doesn't seem to have the reach to put the chain on the outer chainring. I figure I'll need to move either one or both of the spacers to the non-drive side to get the FD to work. I don't have any more time to fiddle with it tonight, but if anyone has experience with this issue, I'd appreciate some words of wisdom before I do the trial and error method of wisdom gaining.
 

kiwisimon

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Dec 14, 2006
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according to this PDF your FD won't work. I am running an SLX drivetrain but as a 1X11.

A road crank has a 43.5 mm chainline. A double SLX crank has a 48.8 mm chainline. Move one of the spacers to the non-drive side and your chainline would be 46.3. Probably workable.
If you move both spacers to the non-drive side, chainline would be 43.8. but then your pedals would not be very centered.
 

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joewein

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Oct 25, 2011
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Sorry I didn't see your post about the FC-M785 38-26 any earlier or I would have told you that if you use a MTB crankset you not only end up with a wider Q-factor (wider pedal stance, which can affect power output) but also issues with FD reach / chain line. MTB parts tend to use a wider bottom bracket but in any case move the rings further out to make more space for wider tires around the chainstays and that creates issues with road FDs which aren't designed to move out that far to push the chain onto the big ring.

When using a MTB crank, only a MTB FD will be certain to work, but that creates issues with Shimano road shifters because cable pull is no longer compatible for 10 and 11 speed parts (only 9 speed). If you use downtube or bar-end shifters that's OK, but STI is a problem. It's much easier to do with SRAM, where cable pull for 10/11 speed is compatible between road and MTB.

EDIT: So one possible fix is actually to use a MTB FD and shift the front chain ring with a bar end shifter and only use STI brifters for controlling the RD.
 
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Karl

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Feb 7, 2011
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according to this PDF your FD won't work. I am running an SLX drivetrain but as a 1X11.

A road crank has a 43.5 mm chainline. A double SLX crank has a 48.8 mm chainline. Move one of the spacers to the non-drive side and your chainline would be 46.3. Probably workable.
If you move both spacers to the non-drive side, chainline would be 43.8. but then your pedals would not be very centered.
Moved a spacer to the non-drive side and the alignment is better, but not great. Took off the FD and running 1x for the time being while I reconsider options.
 
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